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what to do when your kid hurts another



 
 
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  #11  
Old November 2nd 08, 02:38 PM posted to misc.kids
Kat
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another


"toypup" wrote in message
...


"Kat" wrote in message
...
Apologies are useless. Most of the time kids don't mean it and are
saying it for YOU, not them or the other child.


I disagree with this. If a child hurts someone, he must apologize. There
are adults in this world whose egos are so big, they never learn to do
that and it hurts their relationships with others. Even if at first, the
kids apologize to make parents happy, they eventually learn the value of
it when they see the positive effects it has on their relationships with
others. DS has learned to apologize when he makes mistakes and I do
believe he does it with sincerity.

It's useless. I also would spare my child the embarrassment of a big
written letter or apology in person to the child and their parents.


I also disagree here. The letter is not intended to embarrass but rather
it is exactly that -- an apology. If someone hurt me and apologized in a
letter, I would feel better about it.


Both of what you said are fair statements about an apology. Why make him
apologize twice? If your DS is one to feel some kind of remorse for
something that seems to be out of the blue (I get the impression that he's
not one to kick and hurt others on a regular basis, and this little incident
with the other kid is not something that happens every time he's playing
with someone) Anyways, if he is one to feel bad after hurting someone, I
think then the apology would be from him, without you needing to prompt. I
am meaning a forced apology is useless if you need to tell them over and
over.
I know with my DDs, they're at that age where they're at eachother's necks
most of the time. At 2 and 3, hitting seems to be almost a natural reaction
if one takes something away from the other. For this, I have tried to make
one say sorry over and over and over, and it's pointless. For them,
something like a hug is more effective if one kicks or hits the other one
out of frustration.
Even at 2 and 3, though, they do know how to apologize. DD2 (the 2 year
old) even knows how to say sorry - the other day she tripped DD1 and down
DD1 goes. DD2 turned around and said, "Oh! Sorry!"
I realize a 2 year old and 7 year old can't really be compared, but it's
that even a 2 year old can say sorry on their own and mean it as far as what
they think it means. And forcing it IS useless. I would rather have no
apology from another adult for something than one that involves eye rolling
or forcing or snapping or not meaning it.
If your DS is one to feel bad for apologizing, then he'll do it on his own.
And maybe he already did apologize to the other child. He might not have
told you he did say he was sorry, but he also might have. I think the
apology for something like kicking someone else is best done at the time, or
fairly shortly after.

and chances are that the other kid won't really care or remember. Kids
seem to get over things fairly easily. And they'll be back playing and
just fine in no time at all. Dragging it out seems pointless.


I agree that things will be fine. DD got into something with her friend
and I don't remember what it was, but when her friend came over, she took
DD's hand and looked her in the eye and apologized. I am sure her mother
put her up to it, but it was heartfelt and all was better. All would have
been forgotten anyway, but I think that was honorable.


If the child was physically harmed, I'd let it go. Also, another rule of
thumb is not to punish, but to discipline. Shame and all that isn't a
good way to handle things, it seems. If you didn't see it actually
happen, then you can't blame one or the other.


The story was clear cut, as DS is truthful (one quality I admire about
him) and told me exactly what happened. The story was not told by the
neighbor child. I am not attempting to shame my child. I am attempting
to help him to right a wrong. If you hurt someone, is it shameful to
apologize?


No, I didn't mean that. I was just putting a point out that this isn't
something a person wants to do. I didn't mean to imply you were doing it or
going to do it at all.
Did DS apologize to the other child? Help him up, give him a hug, shake his
hand, help him sit down or anything like that? Before you were around?
If he felt bad, did he say he was sorry at the time? Or do something to
say/show he was sorry when he knew he did something wrong? Even a hug could
mean "I'm sorry I did this" - or if he's at the age where hugging someone
else is not alright, helping him up, something else that might have shown he
knew he did something that wasn't alright and tried to make it better?


  #12  
Old November 2nd 08, 03:37 PM posted to misc.kids
Rosalie B.
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another

"toypup" wrote:

and chances are that the other kid won't really care or remember. Kids
seem to get over things fairly easily. And they'll be back playing and
just fine in no time at all. Dragging it out seems pointless.


I agree that things will be fine. DD got into something with her friend and
I don't remember what it was, but when her friend came over, she took DD's
hand and looked her in the eye and apologized. I am sure her mother put her
up to it, but it was heartfelt and all was better. All would have been
forgotten anyway, but I think that was honorable.

Having been on the receiving end....

When dd#1 was about 2, we went to visit my old friend (we were in school
together from kindergarten to 8th grade). We were both pregnant and she had a
little boy who was about a year older than dd. The child was massively jealous
of the attention that his mom was paying to me and to dd#1. So he hauled off
and hit her over the head with a metal train engine.

His mom was mortified of course. DD#1 didn't even cry - she just kind of looked
at him, and then went on with what she was doing. My friend did something in
the way of mitigation that I thought was appropriate at the time but I confess
that I don't remember what it was. DD didn't appear to be hurt, so I wasn't
upset.

I could see what his problem was and that he really didn't have the language to
address it - what he wanted was for us to leave so he could have his mom's
exclusive attention again, but I wasn't going to do that.

  #13  
Old November 2nd 08, 05:12 PM posted to misc.kids
toypup[_2_]
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Posts: 222
Default what to do when your kid hurts another



"Chookie" wrote in message
news:ehrebeniuk-BDDA7F.23434702112008@news...
Not anywhere near that. I would have insisted on an apology, but what
followed would have depended somewhat on context. If the victim no longer
wanted to play then I would certainly have taken him home, of course, but
most
kids I see seem to forgive each other quickly and just want to get on with
their games. Life is full of little spats and putting them behind us is
also
a desirable skill. And little boys are little boys, and they *do* tend to
play fighting games. Note also that a child may by chance land a more
painful
blow than they expect - eg, if a kick is aimed at the leg but lands in the
groin.


Actually, if the child was hurt during a fighting game, it would not have
bothered me much, unless the child was very hurt, but even then I wouldn't
have punished him.

Why is dropping your crackers such a bad thing to your son?


I don't know, but I do know that when I accidentally made him drop a cracker
once not long ago, he threw a screaming fit. There's something about
crackers.


Did DS have a bad day, less sleep than usual or was he hyped up on sugar?


Not that I know of.


Was the other child actually hurt? I mean, did the child need more
attention
than a moment's cuddle and a Band-Aid? If the child wants Mummy, he is
really
hurt, but if he cheers up at the sight of an Elmo Band-Aid, he's fine. I
would be concerned if a 7yo had managed to deliberately inflict serious
pain
on a little kid, though as I said, it's usually accidental at that age.
They
don't have the coordination to do it deliberately.


It was deliberate; and the child, who normally just gets up and walks things
off, was doubled up on the ground crying. He did want to go home.


In sum, I think the long list of punishments is too much for what I am
assuming is a rare outburst which didn't do much damage. Remember,
children
are not little adults, and civilising them is a gradual process.


I think what bothered me most is that the child was so much smaller than DS
and that is was deliberate for no good reason. DS has fought before, and I
normally only give time outs. It just shocked me that he would hurt a small
child like that. It was by no means a fair fight. The little boy did not
hit him or anything and wasn't big enough to defend himself.



  #14  
Old November 2nd 08, 05:17 PM posted to misc.kids
toypup[_2_]
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another



"Kat" wrote in message
...
Did DS apologize to the other child? Help him up, give him a hug, shake
his hand, help him sit down or anything like that?


Not at all to any of the above. He was yelling and screaming about the
other child for making him drop his crackers. He felt he was in the right
at the time.

Before you were around?
If he felt bad, did he say he was sorry at the time? Or do something to
say/show he was sorry when he knew he did something wrong? Even a hug
could mean "I'm sorry I did this" - or if he's at the age where hugging
someone else is not alright, helping him up, something else that might
have shown he knew he did something that wasn't alright and tried to make
it better?


No. That's why he needs to apologize.

  #15  
Old November 2nd 08, 08:26 PM posted to misc.kids
Stephanie[_2_]
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another

toypup wrote:
DS is 7 yo and he kicked his 5 yo friend who was visiting in our
house. I was mortified. DS knows better to hit, and this child is
so much smaller than he and for no real reason (he claims the other
child made him drop his crackers). I immediately made him apologize
and sent DS to his room and he is still sitting there. I brought the
other child home and apologized to the mom. I talked it over with DH
and we came up with a punishment of no friends for five days and he
needs to write a letter of apology to the 5 yo, along with a verbal
and heartfelt apology to the child and his mom. What would you do?



This seems odd to me. My approach would actually be different I think. I
definitely thinking remedy and/or amends in the thick of the situation is
appropriate. But after that had passed, I would be trying a different tack.
I would first focus on what was the problem. It may seem obvious frustration
at dropping the crackers. But ... it may be something else. You can't find
the solution until you know the problem.

Example... we were at Disney World and my dd had gotten a balloon. DS
(elder) kept trying to grab it out of her hand and fiddle with it. My MIL
and FIL and husband all thought he was trying to grab it from her. (He was
offered a balloon and declined.) I took him aside and learned that he was
worried that she was going to loose it harkening back to an experience he
had where a series of balloons let go at the point where the balloon
connected to the string. He was so shook up by that old experience that he
has not wanted a balloon since and was worried about his sister's feelings
should she loose this very special balloon.

If I had punished him for "grabbing" his sister's balloon, he would not have
understood a lesson and would have been anxious about the stupid balloon the
rest of the day. Likely he woudl attempt to "grab" more to protect her
balloon. But instead I was able to reassure him that these balloons are put
together better than the cheap ones at the grocery store and that it is tied
to her wrist and that we were not going to let her suffer the loss of that
balloon shoudl it wind up flying away. The rest of the day proceeded with no
further grabbing.

If your son is not normally a hitter, even when frustrated, there may be
something else going on related to crackers or something else not obvious.
If you can get to a sense of what he felt the problem is, you can guide him
into better techniques to handle the problem the next time a similar
situation comes up... so he does not need to hit.

Dont know if that makse sense.

Best of luck.

S



  #16  
Old November 2nd 08, 10:14 PM posted to misc.kids
Anne Rogers
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Posts: 1,497
Default what to do when your kid hurts another

Sue wrote:
Holy crap, not all of what your planning, that's for sure. Sending the child
home, having your son apologize, and sending your son to his room would be
all I would do. I think you are over-reacting. Kids do this stuff and it's
quite normal. However, no friends for five days is quite a lot and a letter,
and apologizing to the mom is over the top, imo.


To be honest I'd doubt that a 7 year old could fully understand the link
between what he'd done and the consequences of no friends over and the
writing of the letter. They might superficially appear to understand it,
but sometimes they then come out with things that make you realise they
really didn't. Besides it sounds like maybe not having friends over is a
bit backwards, the kick seems to have come out of frustration with
something the other child was doing, maybe he was bothered that he was
expected to play with this child, but unable to verbalise that, or
explain it, so maybe not having friends over might be the desired result
rather than a punishment! (not saying it is, but food for thought?).

Cheers
Anne
  #17  
Old November 2nd 08, 10:22 PM posted to misc.kids
Anne Rogers
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another


You can't force an apology that means much out of a child unless they do it
on their own.


I'm not convinced that not making a child say something because they
don't mean it is necessarily the way to go in the long term. Take basic
manners, like saying please and thank you. If you do baby sign language
that might be something you are working on before they are one, without
sign language it's still something that you think about well before age
2. But for months or even years the understanding of the child is
unlikely to go beyond I do this because this is what I have to do to
make my mother give me a drink, not because they have a true sense of
the meaning. Saying the word sorry is less generic than please or thank
you, but it's heading that way. Saying please, thank you, sorry and
responding if a question is asked is pretty much my bottom line of basic
manners and so far it seems to be working and not saying sorry is
unacceptable in our house, though our children do seem to be wired such
that they cannot say sorry without meaning it in some way and if there
is no remorse in them at all, they stubbornly refuse to apologise, which
results in time out.

Cheers
Anne
  #18  
Old November 3rd 08, 01:25 AM posted to misc.kids
toypup[_2_]
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Posts: 222
Default what to do when your kid hurts another



"Anne Rogers" wrote in message
...
really didn't. Besides it sounds like maybe not having friends over is a
bit backwards, the kick seems to have come out of frustration with
something the other child was doing, maybe he was bothered that he was
expected to play with this child, but unable to verbalise that, or explain
it, so maybe not having friends over might be the desired result rather
than a punishment! (not saying it is, but food for thought?).


Well, he wanted the kid to come over, so I think he did want to play with
the friend, at least before the cracker incident.

  #19  
Old November 3rd 08, 03:40 AM posted to misc.kids
Rosalie B.
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Default what to do when your kid hurts another

"toypup" wrote:

"Chookie" wrote in message
news:ehrebeniuk-BDDA7F.23434702112008@news...

Actually, if the child was hurt during a fighting game, it would not have
bothered me much, unless the child was very hurt, but even then I wouldn't
have punished him.

Why is dropping your crackers such a bad thing to your son?


I don't know, but I do know that when I accidentally made him drop a cracker
once not long ago, he threw a screaming fit. There's something about
crackers.

snip
Was the other child actually hurt?

snip
It was deliberate; and the child, who normally just gets up and walks things
off, was doubled up on the ground crying. He did want to go home.

snip
I think what bothered me most is that the child was so much smaller than DS
and that is was deliberate for no good reason. DS has fought before, and I
normally only give time outs. It just shocked me that he would hurt a small
child like that. It was by no means a fair fight. The little boy did not
hit him or anything and wasn't big enough to defend himself.

But there WAS a good reason, or what your son thinks of as a good reason - you
said it yourself - your son really hates to drop crackers. He was infuriated
because the other kid (not knowing the importance of crackers I guess) made him
drop his. Perhaps you need to figure out what it is about crackers.

DD#2 used to complain bitterly that there was a little boy (name of Wayne IIRC)
who would insisted on sitting next to her and who would throw her down on the
playground. When I finally saw Wayne, I could not understand it because Wayne
was WAY smaller than dd#2 (This was about 2nd or 3rd grade). She could easily
have kept him from doing anything to her.

It sounds like your ds over-reacted because crackers were so important to him,
and he probably felt that his little friend did it on purpose. And maybe the
friend DID do it on purpose, not realizing the importance of crackers. Size
isn't really relevant when someone is enraged.

Most of the time when there's a disagreement, there are really two people at
fault. The friend just got a little more than he bargained for.
  #20  
Old November 3rd 08, 05:29 AM posted to misc.kids
Anne Rogers
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Posts: 1,497
Default what to do when your kid hurts another


Well, he wanted the kid to come over, so I think he did want to play
with the friend, at least before the cracker incident.


My son is only 5, but already he will express desires which are the
exact opposite of what he really wants because he's thinking a few steps
ahead, so he might figure out that if we have guests that means we get
to have dessert then start asking if we can invite guests over,
superficially it might seem that that is all it is about, but then we
find out it isn't. If it's happening and we notice, then I'll bet there
are times when it all happens without something obvious making us
realise it wasn't a true desire.

Cheers
Anne
 




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