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#21
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pregnant 17 year old
My children are all under 6 right now, and I hope they do not become pg
as teens, but I do know I would help them if they did because I would want my grandchildren to get a better start than would be possible if I kicked them out. If I had a man who didn't see eye to eye with me on this issue, it could be a deal breaker. My suggestion to you and your wife is to get time away from your kids to talk. I am not a huge believer in counselling. I prefer to just discuss things with my dh. We get along well, but if you guys cannot talk without fighting, then maybe a counsellor could help. You do need to resolve this very important issue. KC Chris wrote: My stepdaughter decided to get pregnant again. The first pregnancy did not come to term. She will be 18 next month. Her mother prefers to have her continue to live in our home even though I informed both of them the first time around that I refused to allow a second family to live here. Mother claims that she will not be able to make it financially if she moves out. The father claims that he will help out and that they will live together. He was dead against the first pregnancy, but now agrees to help with this one. (change of heart?) Although she carries a part time job, her daughter is basically lazy and has no concern for personal/financial responsibility. The reason why I will not allow a second family to live here is because my marriage (first family) is already hanging on a thread. Another family will only add to our troubles, not to mention that we cannot afford to support another family. Any suggestions? |
#22
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pregnant 17 year old
On Fri, 7 Oct 2005 21:34:02 -0700, "Chris" wrote:
You must be posting from Zimbabwe. Afterall, there is an abundance of "tiny, helpless" babies there for you to be taking care of. This is a strawman. The discussion was about spouse and child. My family consists of me and my wife. Her daughter has now left the family to yoke with another man. The only connection that I have with her is the fact that she is residing in my home off of my dime. Uhm, she's "legally" your stepdaughter. It's a sad statement about you that you have no connection with her. When push comes to shove, it is "legality" that will prevail. Mores the pity for your wife. Sorry, too many women's shelters or other escapes for ANY woman to be homeless. Not to mention, I have never seen a single homeless woman in my neck of the woods; and it's a big city. Whether or not her daughter chooses to be homeless with a baby has what to do with me? A shelter is not a home. It wasn't me who initiated the "legality" thing into this discussion. But let me guess, you believe that legality has no effect in this situation? No, I'm quite sure you'll go to great lengths to make sure it has an effect. Whether your marriage survives that is anyone's guess. We don't have children so that we can boot them out the door at the magic age of 18. Did you marry your wife thinking you'd be rid of the daughter when she reached 18? YES. That's what my wife told me that she and her daughter desired BEFORE we got married. In fact, her daughter expressed her wishes years ago and has already left for days at a time. Uhm, people, situations, things change. I am with my dh, thinking he's always going to be able to work and support us. I'm not foolish enough to think that may change tomorrow. I can appreciate the unable aspect of not borrowing money. I wouldn't be able to do that either. But good grief, emotional support can go a long way. Perhaps, but there is no emotional connection between her child and me. Just yesterday, she again told me to take a hike. The emotional connection should be there through your wife. She is your wife's child, and you are disrespecting that relationship. I see. So you too have no problem with some man molesting your child and getting her knocked up not once but TWICE! No, our marriage would be in peril because of your attitude against my daughter receiving my help. She would come BEFORE you. Argh! Here again, emotional support is necessary. Maybe so, but not my obligation. To your wife. Wow, you're some piece of work. Thank you. It wasn't a compliment. Nan |
#24
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pregnant 17 year old
Nan wrote: On Fri, 7 Oct 2005 21:34:02 -0700, "Chris" wrote: No, our marriage would be in peril because of your attitude against my daughter receiving my help. She would come BEFORE you. I feel sorry for your husband. He married the wrong woman. Wow, you're some piece of work. Thank you. It wasn't a compliment. You are as naive as you are stupid. Nan Regards... |
#25
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pregnant 17 year old
Chris wrote: "agent99" wrote in message oups.com... wrote: Chris wrote: "Nikki" wrote in message ... Chris wrote: For starters, thank you very much for your response! Now, I will respond, with all due respect, to your post below. "alath" wrote in message ups.com... If you ask your wife to choose between her daughter and her "marriage hanging by a thread" husband, her daughter will win, and rightly so. To understand you correctly, are you saying that a woman's commitment to her daughter ought to trump her commitment to her husband? Can't speak for Alath but I would pick my children over my husband, who is their actual bio father. I'm not saying her decision to support her daughter by giving her a place to live is right or wrong but that many parents would pick their children over anyone else. I suspect my husband would pick the kids over me if an issue arose where he felt he had to pick. I hope he would. Not me. My comittment is to my wife FIRST and foremost! As it should be. That depends. Ideally, the parents of the child put everyone in the family's wellbeing at a premium, and recognise that for parents to care well for kids, they themselves must be well taken care of. That's why my wife comes first. Fair enough. And her commitment to you should be above the children. The order that should follow is: 1. God or some moral belief. For example, if your spouse told you to kill another human, you should not do so. 2. Your spouse. You put the needs of your spouse before the needs of your children. Your children will grow and start their own lives, but in the end, it's just the two of you. So, lemme get this straight: if you're short on food, the spouse gets food, but the kids don't? What if there's a fire, or a capsized boat, and only one person can be saved? Kid or parent? SPOUSE. Last I checked, my marriage covenant was with my wife......... not her child. Well, I hope she's okay with that. If it was me, I wouldn't be, but then if I were in a position where I might marry someone who was not the biological father of my children, I would not do it if he wasn't wholly committed to being their de facto father. I wouldn't want to be married to a man who felt that his commitment only extended to me, and who didn't consider my children his family. But that's my personal feeling only, and if you and your wife have a different arrangement, that's your business. I hope my spouse chooses kid - I certainly would. And if you think this argument is spurious, consider that most families in the world do have to consider the food issue, and most parents throughout history have gone without in order that their children might have the best chance at survival. You're the one with the psych 101 understanding of natural selection, agsf, surely you recognise that adult animals strive to ensure the survival of their young, so that they too might procreate? What do animals have to do with this discussion? I'm merely remarking on agsf's frequent references to human sexual preferences from a "survival of the species" perspective. The same sort of argument would support the notion that parents generally put their offspring's wellbeing above their own. Oh, and the scenario where it's just the two of you, and your children have fled the nest and have their own lives? That's the middle, not the end. In the end, most likely one of you has outlived the other, and has medical and physical needs which your children are more likely to take care of than the state is, so you'd better be sure you fostered a good relationship with them and helped them to be successful as best you could when you had the chance, because they are going to either be caring for you, or choosing the facility that does it in their stead. 3. Your children. Your children's birthdays and/or sporting events or any other needs surpass those of family and friends. Ohhhh. Birthday parties and sporting events are the "needs" of which we speak. I see. Not, you know, the reproductive autonomy of a sexually mature young woman who lives with her mother and stepfather, and the wellbeing of her unborn child. My mistake. Since when does a grandmother have any commitment to the wellbeing of her unborn grandchild? Wow. I can't believe you asked that. Ummm, since always? Regardless of the circumstances of the pregnancy, most women concern themselves when their daughters get pregnant. Otherwise, words like "grandmother" and "grandchild" wouldn't exist. Grandmothers are often present at the births of grandchildren, and all over the world are traditionally the ones who help nurse their daughters and daughters-in-law, and grandchildren, through the later stages of pregnancy and the newborn phase. In some Asian cultures, the unborn child's grandmother will move in with the parents to assist both before and after the baby is born. That's some pretty serious commitment to the "wellbeing of her unborn grandchild," and it's almost universal. I understand your disapproval of your stepdaughter's choices - she has been very irresponsible. What I don't get is your apparent belief that your wife shouldn't feel any need, borne of love, to care for her child and grandchild. Also, his step-daughter is not taking the baby into consideration. Why should he and his wife be burdened by the lack of responsibility of his step-child? For someone who believes in a moral code, you got no notion of compassion, have you? "Compassion" and "morality" are not codependent terms. Indeed they are not. Cruel acts are frequently committed under the guise of morality. 99 |
#26
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pregnant 17 year old
agent99 wrote: wrote: Oh, and the scenario where it's just the two of you, and your children have fled the nest and have their own lives? That's the middle, not the end. In the end, most likely one of you has outlived the other, and has medical and physical needs which your children are more likely to take care of than the state is, so you'd better be sure you fostered a good relationship with them and helped them to be successful as best you could when you had the chance, because they are going to either be caring for you, or choosing the facility that does it in their stead. Hopefully you raised children of high moral value and have taken the necessary steps during your life to compensate for this. Right. In my opinion, this means considering the family as a whole, not placing the needs of parents or children above the needs of the whole family - basically, not contributing to spoiling or selfishness on either side. I have to somewhat disagree with you. Although the family as a whole should be taken into consideration, the order that I listed should be followed. In the case of this guy, I question his commitment to his wife, because he comments that the marriage is hanging by a thread, and because his commitment obviously doesn't extend to his stepdaughter, her daughter. I'm sure he supported her when she was younger. ... But then, I think "I'll marry you and be your spouse and honour and respect you, but not consider your children my children, or their children my grandchildren," a bad attitude, too. It all depends on the situation. In this situation I have to side with Chris. This guy obviously has some pretty big issues at home, and I don't know what he and his wife can do to solve those issues. In my culture, however, my parents and my children are part of the same (extended) family. They are not a second family. My grandmother lives with my parents, and she is not considered a member of a second family who lives under their roof. I also suspect that in your culture, young women don't sleep around and get pregnant either. It's easy to confuse westernized points of views with your own, but you will have to acknowledge the differences and understand that these differences is what makes your culture thrive while the westerners decline. In his frustration, which is clearly justified, I worry that Chris is trying to say that his wife's daughter isn't really a part of his family. I would not want to be married to a man who considered me his family, but not my children. Again, that's an issue that he and his wife need to work out. I'm sure he supported her and accepted her when she was a child. However, at this point, she is an adult who shares different moral views than his. He should not be expected to take on the responsibility and burden that she has created. You're not a fan of hers? By some of your posts, I'd have pegged you for her acolyte. I've been called a lot of insulting things online, but this remark tops all of them. 99 Regards... |
#27
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pregnant 17 year old
On 8 Oct 2005 12:57:55 -0700, "
wrote: Nan wrote: On Fri, 7 Oct 2005 21:34:02 -0700, "Chris" wrote: No, our marriage would be in peril because of your attitude against my daughter receiving my help. She would come BEFORE you. I feel sorry for your husband. He married the wrong woman. This same sentiment applies to your wife, sweetie. Nan |
#28
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pregnant 17 year old
Chris wrote:
Since when does a grandmother have any commitment to the wellbeing of her unborn grandchild? Well it has been hypothesised that female menopause in humans evolved so as to 'free up' older women to assist younger women with childrearing since they were no longer fertile themselves. Apparently no other species experiences female menopause. Jacqueline |
#29
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pregnant 17 year old
"Chris" wrote in message
news:7gI1f.695$UF4.55@fed1read02... What is your source for such morality? You seem to have lost sight of the fact that I am referring to the "woman" (according to law) that her daughter will soon be, not a dependent child. Possibly, but that does not negate the effect of having a molester on the prowl. Most likely, the odds would be reduced from slim to none. No great loss. Ok, back up a minute here. Your step-daughter consented to sex with this man, right? (FWIW, the legal age of consent is 16 here in NZ, so where I live it would not be considered statutory rape). Legalities aside for a moment, in your mind, is your step-daughter a child or a woman? If she's a child and the victim of a 'molester on the prowl', she deserves and needs the full support and protection of your wife and yourself. If she's a woman, then she's capable of making her own decisions and you can hardly consider making statutory rape claims against the father. In my opinion, she's neither, regardless of what the law says. She's a teenager, capable of making her own life changing decisions, but ill-equipped to forsee the long term consequences of those choices. If your wife does not give her any kind of support now, she risks losing her daughter forever. Your wife is handling a crisis situation the only way she knows how right now. I'm sure the thought of losing her daughter is a much scarier prospect than the thought of losing a husband who is not helping the immediate situation (no offence intended). If you want to save your marriage, I suspect you're going to have to start biting your tongue a little more. Your step-daughter is young and naive, your wife is panicking for the well-being of her daughter and grandchild, the baby's father is not up to the task, and your family is relying on you to show some maturity and accept what has happened, even if you don't like the short term changes it might involve. Saying that it isn't fair, isn't your responsibility, etc etc may be true to an extent, but with a marriage hanging by a thread, statements based on selfish thinking such as that are not going to benefit your situation! You knew your wife had a daughter when you married her, presumably, and in marrying your wife you accepted her daughter as your own. She doesn't like you? Get over it. Plenty of teenagers 'don't like' their parents, and it's down to the parents to show more maturity and ride it out. I don't think you're thinking of the long-term outcome any more than your step-daughter is, to be honest. What is the worst that can happen, by standing by your step-daughter and helping her to get ahead, albeit reluctantly? Possibly 5-6 years of hardship and a disorganised family environment, which with the right support your step-daughter will emerge from with greater maturity and sense of personal responsibility. The child will be in school, she can get training, get a job, and the spin-off from that is a happy wife, a secure marriage, and someone who will look after you in the same way when you're old. Chances are, this girl could be picking out your rest home in 30-40 years, so you might want to make the effort. I speak from some experience here, because I remember being 17, and I had a mother who stood by me even though she didn't like the situation. -- Amy Mum to Carlos born sleeping 20/11/02, & Ana born screaming 30/06/04 http://www.freewebs.com/carlos2002/ http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/ana%5Fj%5F2004/ My blog: http://spaces.msn.com/members/querer-hijo-querer-hija/ |
#30
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pregnant 17 year old
"KC" wrote in message ps.com... My children are all under 6 right now, and I hope they do not become pg as teens, but I do know I would help them if they did because I would want my grandchildren to get a better start than would be possible if I kicked them out. If I had a man who didn't see eye to eye with me on this issue, it could be a deal breaker. My suggestion to you and your wife is to get time away from your kids to talk. I am not a huge believer in counselling. I prefer to just discuss things with my dh. We get along well, but if you guys cannot talk without fighting, then maybe a counsellor could help. You do need to resolve this very important issue. KC We are working on it. Thanks for the input! Chris wrote: My stepdaughter decided to get pregnant again. The first pregnancy did not come to term. She will be 18 next month. Her mother prefers to have her continue to live in our home even though I informed both of them the first time around that I refused to allow a second family to live here. Mother claims that she will not be able to make it financially if she moves out. The father claims that he will help out and that they will live together. He was dead against the first pregnancy, but now agrees to help with this one. (change of heart?) Although she carries a part time job, her daughter is basically lazy and has no concern for personal/financial responsibility. The reason why I will not allow a second family to live here is because my marriage (first family) is already hanging on a thread. Another family will only add to our troubles, not to mention that we cannot afford to support another family. Any suggestions? |
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